http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rabbi-shmuley-boteach/the-myth-that-michael-jac_b_338196.html

lmao Rabbi smelly....hahaha classic!

he already came out with tapes..why he keep poppin up?
lol sit down shesh :whatever:

Ummm...
I agree with every word he wrote.

lmao Rabbi smelly....hahaha classic!

he already came out with tapes..why he keep poppin up?
lol sit down shesh :whatever:

Clearly, he's shamelessly promoting his book throughout the piece. :whatever: Maybe it's not selling as well as he had hoped? :D

Ummm...
I agree with every word he wrote.

Almost everything, for me. Among the things I disagreed with, are his three essentials for fame.

Michael recorded these tapes for the express purpose of making it available in a book because he was tired of the myth.

Oh Rabbi! :laugh: Stop it! :laugh:

You know as well as I do that was not the reason - you fool. It was for a book on parenting and you guys discussed good/bad parenting and related each other's experience of childhood parenting in order to have some firm ideas with which to begin. The irony is...Rabbi is doing his own myth making.

However, the Rabbi's writings is basic pop psychology and this is something anyone with a deep interest in psychology can do. Hell, most can do it better! But it is still true to say Michael did have happy moments in life - that shouldn't be forgotten. He found happiness wherever and whenever he could. It appears that Rabbi lacks much understanding of emotional pain which MJ tried to articulate on several occasions.

Yet Michael was happy enough to do TII - after all, it's what he always said he was born to do and was home.

I, for one, agree with Rabbi Shmuley. If Michael remained in his faith and had a good wife it would have made all the difference. I have no illusions about Michael. There were essentials missing in his life. I know he tried to have a "normal" life with LMP, but he really needed to try again to look for love with a woman who would keep him grounded and have his children. Look at the situation that has developed - none of his children have a mother they can turn to (Debbie Rowe outsourced that responsibility, and legally Blanket has no mother). There would be no question as to who would be raising his children after his death. A good wife would have protected him from the those who wanted to take advantage of him. A firm realtionship with God would have also protected him, allowed him to learn to love himself, and to heal all the past hurts - especially with his dad. God would have been the father he needed in his life since Joe left much to be desired.

As much as I love Michael for his uniqueness, I didn't like everything he did. The nose jobs irked the heck out of me. His nose was beautiful the way God made it. There was nothing he could do about the vitiligo and lupus, so I understand. He was too stubborn and didn't like it when his own staff disagreed with him. He should have gotten rid of all the hangers-on and yes men who agreed to give him anything he wanted, including deadly painkillers.

Clearly, he's shamelessly promoting his book throughout the piece. :whatever: Maybe it's not selling as well as he had hoped? :D
I haven't even read it yet- I'm in a hurry. I opened it and saw the date though... *rolling my eyes* So obvious he's wanting to latch on to the publicity of TII to try to help the sales of his book.

and Pompous...... AGREE. Without even reading it I agree completely with you about what you said atleast.. I'll read it later.

I, for one, agree with Rabbi Shmuley. If Michael remained in his faith and had a good wife it would have made all the difference. I have no illusions about Michael. There were essentials missing in his life. I know he tried to have a "normal" life with LMP, but he really needed to try again to look for love with a woman who would keep him grounded and have his children. Look at the situation that has developed - none of his children have a mother they can turn to (Debbie Rowe outsourced that responsibility, and legally Blanket has no mother). There would be no question as to who would be raising his children after his death. A good wife would have protected him from the those who wanted to take advantage of him. A firm realtionship with God would have also protected him, allowed him to learn to love himself, and to heal all the past hurts - especially with his dad. God would have been the father he needed in his life since Joe left much to be desired.

As much as I love Michael for his uniqueness, I didn't like everything he did. The nose jobs irked the heck out of me. His nose was beautiful the way God made it. There was nothing he could do about the vitiligo and lupus, so I understand. He was too stubborn and didn't like it when his own staff disagreed with him. He should have gotten rid of all the hangers-on and yes men who agreed to give him anything he wanted, including deadly painkillers.
Michael had a close real relationship with God and perhaps thats what kept him from coming out.

Michael had a close real relationship with God and perhaps thats what kept him from coming out.

From coming out?! :shock:

I think if you start creeping into Michael's sexuality, you're gonna get your thread closed real quick. Let's not go there.

Michael had a close real relationship with God and perhaps thats what kept him from coming out.

?? Huh? What?

And I don't like the implication that only people who are religious can be truly normal/happy/functional. I am sorry, but this is so far from the truth. I am not a very religious person right now and I lead quite a normal life with a strong moral system. If having strong faith keeps people grounded and happy, more power to them. But not everybody has to be like that.

And as far as I know Michael was religious and had a very close relationship with God. How can he say that Michael lacked sprituality?

Also, not everybody needs a significant other in his/her life. Some people are very happy in a marriage and that's totally fine, but some people are tend to be loners and that's totally fine too.

Did Michael have problems? Hell yes, he did. Anybody who requires Propofol to sleep have big, deep problems in my opinion. Yes, he was a tragic figure in some regards. Yes he did go too far with the plastic surgery. But his psychological problems didn't stem from his lack of sprituality (and that's not true anyway, he only left the church, he didn't leave the faith), they stemmed from abuse he received in his childhood.

I, for one, agree with Rabbi Shmuley. If Michael remained in his faith and had a good wife it would have made all the difference. I have no illusions about Michael. There were essentials missing in his life. I know he tried to have a "normal" life with LMP, but he really needed to try again to look for love with a woman who would keep him grounded and have his children. Look at the situation that has developed - none of his children have a mother they can turn to (Debbie Rowe outsourced that responsibility, and legally Blanket has no mother). There would be no question as to who would be raising his children after his death. A good wife would have protected him from the those who wanted to take advantage of him. A firm realtionship with God would have also protected him, allowed him to learn to love himself, and to heal all the past hurts - especially with his dad. God would have been the father he needed in his life since Joe left much to be desired.

As much as I love Michael for his uniqueness, I didn't like everything he did. The nose jobs irked the heck out of me. His nose was beautiful the way God made it. There was nothing he could do about the vitiligo and lupus, so I understand. He was too stubborn and didn't like it when his own staff disagreed with him. He should have gotten rid of all the hangers-on and yes men who agreed to give him anything he wanted, including deadly painkillers.


I'm sorry, but I find this very presumptuous, to say the LEAST! How dare you presume to know anything about Michael's "relationship with God," much less pass judgment on him for it! W.T.F.!? Who the hell do you think you are to do such a thing? I would love to say a lot more, but I'd better not. :angry: :rant: :cussing: :banghead:

Michael had a close real relationship with God and perhaps thats what kept him from coming out.

What does that mean?

I was going to ask the same thing - what do you mean, Bonitadita? Are you insinuating that MJ was a closet gay man? I have nothing against gay people at all - not at all. But MJ wasn't gay. :huh:

And he never lost his faith in God. No matter what his religious beliefs were (JW or not), God was always a huge part of his life. This was always very clear.

The Rabbi is an ass if he thinks only religious people can be healthy in mind. MJ left the JW faith, but never God. If he was still a part of the JWs he would still have been a man with some big problems - he was too eager to please the Elders in the early 80s and his fame grew making it harder for him there. So he left. Wisely for him.

It's naive to think his problems would've been solved if he had a wife. Almost certainly it was his massive fame that made any problem he had worse - a wife would not have been able to help that one. Ultimately, one person cannot save another. Only the person can do that.

Michael recorded these tapes for the express purpose of making it available in a book because he was tired of the myth.

Oh Rabbi! :laugh: Stop it! :laugh:

You know as well as I do that was not the reason - you fool. It was for a book on parenting and you guys discussed good/bad parenting and related each other's experience of childhood parenting in order to have some firm ideas with which to begin. The irony is...Rabbi is doing his own myth making.

However, the Rabbi's writings is basic pop psychology and this is something anyone with a deep interest in psychology can do. Hell, most can do it better! But it is still true to say Michael did have happy moments in life - that shouldn't be forgotten. He found happiness wherever and whenever he could. It appears that Rabbi lacks much understanding of emotional pain which MJ tried to articulate on several occasions.

Yet Michael was happy enough to do TII - after all, it's what he always said he was born to do and was home.

I agree! This is just shameless self promotion. And why does this man feel that marriage is so necessary for psychological well-being? There are many single people out there, famous and non famous alike who are doing just fine without a spouse!

And of course Michael had his problems, but why choose this time to highlight them, now that the world has seen the film and is just starting to realize what a great personality he had? I mean, I saw haters who were converted by that film.
Why is it that anytime something good is happening for MJ, someone always has to drag him down? He was not perfect. WE KNOW THIS ALREADY SHMULEY. And even if we didn't, you more than made it clear in your BOOK. You did not have to write another article about it.

We have lost him. Instead of focusing on what a tragic figure he was, why don't we try to see his good nature instead? Why don't we try, for just once, to focus on the gift, the music. THAT is the lesson that we should learn from his passing. To see the good in people, to be able to accept that not everyone is perfect but in the face of adversity and in the midst of your difficulties, you can still be something great. I am just tired of people using Michael as an example of how not to live your life.

Also, just to point out that so many marriages have problems which can actually ADD to a person's psychological irregulation. So for this Rabbi to say, all MJ needed was to be married again to be a happier person, really is not proven.

From coming out?! :shock:

I think if you start creeping into Michael's sexuality, you're gonna get your thread closed real quick. Let's not go there.

Um, I think it meant Michael coming out for help, not out of the closet.

And I agree, this is shameless self promotion.

Also, just to point out that so many marriages have problems which can actually ADD to a person's psychological irregulation. So for this Rabbi to say, all MJ needed was to be married again to be a happier person, really is not proven.

Yes, that is very true.

This Rabbi is a walking joke, terrible at psychology and is simply interested in making money from people who fall for his dire pop psychology. Avoid this man like the plague.

A good marriage would certainly have helped MJ.

*keeping my lesbian atheist mouth shut, but subscribing to watch the thread anyway*

I'm sorry, but I find this very presumptuous, to say the LEAST! How dare you presume to know anything about Michael's "relationship with God," much less pass judgment on him for it! W.T.F.!? Who the hell do you think you are to do such a thing? I would love to say a lot more, but I'd better not.

My, my, my!!! You are an angry one. Sheesh! I'm not doubting that Michael had a relationship with God. He did. Everyone's relationship with God is different, has varying intensity and is reflected in how they live. I'm implying that something was missing. God never called his believers to be "islands". Being a part of a community of believers is essential because iron sharpens iron. When Michael was active in the JW faith, he had fellowship and community that kept him grounded and free from scandal. You become more vulnerable to "attack" when you separate yourself from the group. Had Michael remained in a believing community there would be no Arnie Klein, Steve Hoefflin, Conrad Murray, Debbie Rowe, Jordie, Gavin, Sneddon, or Bashir. These and other "dangerous influences" would have never had access to him. He would have loved himself, had true friends, found true love, would have never needed a money-hungry surrogate, and certainly wouldn't have anyone around him giving him drugs. This is what Rabbi Shmuley was trying to get at, especially in the book.

I'm not saying that he had to be a JW, but to be a part of believing community in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, who was the only God that Michael believed in. When Michael separated himself, it was the beginning of his downfall. I love him but I can't ignore his mistakes along the way. When Christ said, "Judge not lest you be judged", he meant that we should not judge others for a specific error, if we ourselves are committing the same error. So, if you are not committing the same error, you have every right to call someone else out. Now if I were doing the same things that Michael did, I would have absolutely no right to criticize him. In light of what was going on around him, Michael was not healthy.

No one is perfect. Michael was not God Almighty; nor was he a god, nor did he consider himself a god. I believe he's in God's Hands now and at peace. Read Rabbi Shmuley's book. Unfortunately, there is a lot of truth in the book. It made me cry...

^I don't need to read Schmuley's book to see that MJ had flaws. Everyone can clearly see that MJs flaw was that he was naive, terribly. With money, with 'friends' with certain 'influences'. It just makes him a very complex person. On one hand, he was savvy in business and he dominated the stage like he owned the place. On the other hand, he was vulnerable in some regards. He is not perfect, I don't need Schumley telling me that because I already saw that with the trial.

If I may...Michael had set up his life in such a way that he didn't have to be accountable to anybody. When there is nobody to be accountable to, it is easy for a person to go off the rails. When someone would require accountabilty from Michael, it seems to me that he would dismiss them, detatch from them.
When a person is addicted, they don't want accountabilty. Accountability would mean that they have to look at themselves, and perhaps change thier behavior. It seems Micheal did not have the strength/will/desire to change. Anyone who asked for him to change would find that they couldn't reach him anymore...that is what I have been led to believe.

Schmuley means well....I really believe that. I do not think he means any harm to Michael's memory. He said that if we don't look at what drove Michael to his death, then he will have died in vain.

I intend to agree.

I think Schmuley is rightly concerned that if the public sees him as fit, healthy, happy and peaceful in TII, then they will be missing the boat. The public shrugs and says "Wow...he was doing so great...that damn doctor killed him...what a shame."

And THAT would be a tragic way to think. IMO. Given with love, of course.

My, my, my!!! You are an angry one. Sheesh! I'm not doubting that Michael had a relationship with God. He did. Everyone's relationship with God is different, has varying intensity and is reflected in how they live. I'm implying that something was missing. God never called his believers to be "islands". Being a part of a community of believers is essential because iron sharpens iron. When Michael was active in the JW faith, he had fellowship and community that kept him grounded and free from scandal. You become more vulnerable to "attack" when you separate yourself from the group. Had Michael remained in a believing community there would be no Arnie Klein, Steve Hoefflin, Conrad Murray, Debbie Rowe, Jordie, Gavin, Sneddon, or Bashir. These and other "dangerous influences" would have never had access to him. He would have loved himself, had true friends, found true love, would have never needed a money-hungry surrogate, and certainly wouldn't have anyone around him giving him drugs. This is what Rabbi Shmuley was trying to get at, especially in the book.

I'm not saying that he had to be a JW, but to be a part of believing community in the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, who was the only God that Michael believed in. When Michael separated himself, it was the beginning of his downfall. I love him but I can't ignore his mistakes along the way. When Christ said, "Judge not lest you be judged", he meant that we should not judge others for a specific error, if we ourselves are committing the same error. So, if you are not committing the same error, you have every right to call someone else out. Now if I were doing the same things that Michael did, I would have absolutely no right to criticize him. In light of what was going on around him, Michael was not healthy.

No one is perfect. Michael was not God Almighty; nor was he a god, nor did he consider himself a god. I believe he's in God's Hands now and at peace. Read Rabbi Shmuley's book. Unfortunately, there is a lot of truth in the book. It made me cry...


Yes, I was angry at what you wrote, because I found it offensive and presumptuous, as I said. I'll try to explain why what you wrote (and continue to write) comes across this way to me.

Previously, you wrote:

"A firm realtionship with God would have also protected him, allowed him to learn to love himself, and to heal all the past hurts - especially with his dad. God would have been the father he needed in his life since Joe left much to be desired."

Does that or does that not presume that Michael didn't have a "firm relationship with God"? You say that "something was missing." But how could you possibly know that? Aside from what Michael has shared, only God (presuming that one believes in a god) and each individual would have any knowledge of what that relationship entailed or how it affected that person's life. Michael in the past has frequently spoken of God and how much his faith means to him--do you think he is a liar?

Of course you are certainly entitled to your beliefs, as everyone is, but not everyone looks at faith the same way, so it really is bothersome to me that you pretend to know what would have "protected" or helped Michael--as though you're speaking for God, almost, when you say things like:

"Had Michael remained in a believing community there would be no Arnie Klein, Steve Hoefflin, Conrad Murray, Debbie Rowe, Jordie, Gavin, Sneddon, or Bashir. These and other "dangerous influences" would have never had access to him. He would have loved himself, had true friends, found true love, would have never needed a money-hungry surrogate, and certainly wouldn't have anyone around him giving him drugs."

I find that disturbing. How do you know what God would have done for Michael? Maybe Michael's life turned out the way it did for a reason only God knows right now--as a believer, you surely believe in such things, don't you? Again, this is why I find what you write to be so presumptuous. It comes across to me as though you think you know better than anyone else (and maybe even better than God) how he should have lived his life. But you (and the rest of us) really don't know anything much about his faith or his personal relationship with God (beyond what Michael says) much less how his life might have been different had some element of his faith/faith practices been different. How could one possibly know that?

Fact of the matter is, Michael Jackson could ALSO be vulnerable to the Kleins and Chandlers of the world had he still stayed with the JWs. Anything to the contrary is naive - think of how religious communities have abused, defrauded and other things, but have hidden it from the outside world.

Much of MJ's issues began when he was a part of this so-called 'protective' community. A community that falsely preached about the end of the world - could have been a factor in his leaving since you cannot preach truth and lies at the same time.

When Jesus said, "Judge not lest thou be judged", he categorically meant "Don't judge someone else because you have no idea of the burdens they carry or the strength it takes them to resist temptation" and so on. It does not give someone the misguided right to call someone else out - only "he who is without sin cast the first stone". And no other. It's a standard Jesus called for Christians to try to live up to, but he knew they couldn't "For all have fallen short of the Glory of God".

Schmuley talks out of his backside on this one. A religious community is no more guaranteed to protect someone from charlatans any more than a non-religious community can. If I were him...I'd stop now before he gets a 'DUNCE' cap. Psst, Schmuley...even Jewish communities abuse, defraud and commit sins against others in the same way you say MJ received and was vulnerable to. Utter tosh to say MJ would've been saved by the JWs - look at accounts by ex-JWs in the USA and their experiences as evidence your argument is seriously flawed.

How can anyone give any credibility to a Rabbi who is TERRIBLE at pop psychology?? Lacking in insight and perception? This man is not as sharp as he likes to think.

Michael would disagree with Schmuley on how the public should remember him. Michael wanted to be remembered as an amazing performer and a humanitarian who cared about others as well as being a great father. Everything else is by the by. A positive view of MJ's contributions though is not 'dangerous myth making' like Schmuley imagines. In the end, the cause of anyone's death fades and it is their contributions that takes centre stage because that is where we get the REAL value from their existence. It is more inspiring to know MJ achieved so much despite all that he faced in life on a personal level.

Schmuley doesn't offer any insights into MJ I didn't already know.

How come I can "thanks" on some posts and not others? I want to "thanks" that post PG just made above me.

^^^I see no thanks button in this part of the forum, but you can always rep someone.

The 'thanks' feature is not included on every forum. But you can use the rep feature instead, as an alternative. :)

EDIT - ha ha, never mind. PG got there before me!

Michael had a close real relationship with God and perhaps thats what kept him from coming out.

Oh, so I guess you'd know a gay person if you saw one?
FAIL.

*keeping my lesbian atheist mouth shut, but subscribing to watch the thread anyway*

hahaha! BRILLIANT! ;)

The Rabbi is an ass if he thinks only religious people can be healthy in mind. MJ left the JW faith, but never God. If he was still a part of the JWs he would still have been a man with some big problems - he was too eager to please the Elders in the early 80s and his fame grew making it harder for him there. So he left. Wisely for him.

It's naive to think his problems would've been solved if he had a wife. Almost certainly it was his massive fame that made any problem he had worse - a wife would not have been able to help that one. Ultimately, one person cannot save another. Only the person can do that.
agree

Yes, that is very true.

This Rabbi is a walking joke, terrible at psychology and is simply interested in making money from people who fall for his dire pop psychology. Avoid this man like the plague.
agree again

Fact of the matter is, Michael Jackson could ALSO be vulnerable to the Kleins and Chandlers of the world had he still stayed with the JWs. Anything to the contrary is naive - think of how religious communities have abused, defrauded and other things, but have hidden it from the outside world.

Much of MJ's issues began when he was a part of this so-called 'protective' community. A community that falsely preached about the end of the world - could have been a factor in his leaving since you cannot preach truth and lies at the same time.

When Jesus said, "Judge not lest thou be judged", he categorically meant "Don't judge someone else because you have no idea of the burdens they carry or the strength it takes them to resist temptation" and so on. It does not give someone the misguided right to call someone else out - only "he who is without sin cast the first stone". And no other. It's a standard Jesus called for Christians to try to live up to, but he knew they couldn't "For all have fallen short of the Glory of God".

Schmuley talks out of his backside on this one. A religious community is no more guaranteed to protect someone from charlatans any more than a non-religious community can. If I were him...I'd stop now before he gets a 'DUNCE' cap. Psst, Schmuley...even Jewish communities abuse, defraud and commit sins against others in the same way you say MJ received and was vulnerable to. Utter tosh to say MJ would've been saved by the JWs - look at accounts by ex-JWs in the USA and their experiences as evidence your argument is seriously flawed.

How can anyone give any credibility to a Rabbi who is TERRIBLE at pop psychology?? Lacking in insight and perception? This man is not as sharp as he likes to think.

Michael would disagree with Schmuley on how the public should remember him. Michael wanted to be remembered as an amazing performer and a humanitarian who cared about others as well as being a great father. Everything else is by the by. A positive view of MJ's contributions though is not 'dangerous myth making' like Schmuley imagines. In the end, the cause of anyone's death fades and it is their contributions that takes centre stage because that is where we get the REAL value from their existence. It is more inspiring to know MJ achieved so much despite all that he faced in life on a personal level.

Schmuley doesn't offer any insights into MJ I didn't already know.
agree, agree, agree, agree, AGREE!!!!!!!!!!!!

I finally read the article- I had to get my stomach completely settled beforehand though- because Schmuley is relaly making me want to hurl lately.
Just being honest.

I do not agree with what he wrote- specifically things like needed a wife to keep him HUMBLE? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? :doh:

I don't even want to waste the effort picking apart the entire article- piece by piece (but I could)- I do, however, want to say I agree with PG's posts (so much) and want to also say that Schmuley presumes too much and puts things out as fact that he DOES not and CANNOT know... and he's a liar.
PERIOD.
I say that because he's lied every time he's told the fabricated story about why he lost touch with MJ for many years before his death. Not to mention he keeps speaking about things he can't possibly know- about the years leading up to MJ's passing... since he had no contact with him whatsoever during that time.
I have my thoughts/opinions about MJ's "state of mind" (best way I can put it without getting into a debate about that) for the period of time in and around the time that Schmuley had contact with him and made these tapes/etc. But for him to state things as "fact" about the past 6+years of MJ's life when he didn't know him at all during that time- is appalling and offensive to me.

And I absolutely, with every cell in my body, believe that he's also lying about what MJ expected him to do with those tapes and it didn't have a THING to do with what Schmuley is saying and how he's presenting this book and speaking about Michael the way he is now. simply put- he's flat out lying again!

AND I absolutely think that he's just taking advantage of TII (movie and CD set) to revamp up interest in his book, hopefully this means it isn't selling as well as he'd hoped (*fingers crossed*).

I think the best way to describe what's going on here is thru expression in song.. MJ's song.. Money... so fitting here:
Anything
Anything
Anything for money
Would lie for you
Would die for you
Even sell my soul to the devil
Anything
Anything
Anything for money
Would lie for you
Would die for you
Even sell my soul to the devil
Anything
Anything
Anything for money
Would lie for you
Would die for you
Even sell my soul to the devil
Anything
Anything
Anything for money
Would lie for you
Would die for you
Even sell my soul to the devil
You say you wouldn't do it
For all the money in the world
I don't think so
If you show me the man
Then I will sell him
If you ask me to lie
Then I will tell him
If you're dealing with God
Then you will hell him
You'll do anything for money

Yes, I was angry at what you wrote, because I found it offensive and presumptuous, as I said. I'll try to explain why what you wrote (and continue to write) comes across this way to me.

Previously, you wrote:

"A firm realtionship with God would have also protected him, allowed him to learn to love himself, and to heal all the past hurts - especially with his dad. God would have been the father he needed in his life since Joe left much to be desired."

Does that or does that not presume that Michael didn't have a "firm relationship with God"? You say that "something was missing." But how could you possibly know that? Aside from what Michael has shared, only God (presuming that one believes in a god) and each individual would have any knowledge of what that relationship entailed or how it affected that person's life. Michael in the past has frequently spoken of God and how much his faith means to him--do you think he is a liar?

Of course you are certainly entitled to your beliefs, as everyone is, but not everyone looks at faith the same way, so it really is bothersome to me that you pretend to know what would have "protected" or helped Michael--as though you're speaking for God, almost, when you say things like:

"Had Michael remained in a believing community there would be no Arnie Klein, Steve Hoefflin, Conrad Murray, Debbie Rowe, Jordie, Gavin, Sneddon, or Bashir. These and other "dangerous influences" would have never had access to him. He would have loved himself, had true friends, found true love, would have never needed a money-hungry surrogate, and certainly wouldn't have anyone around him giving him drugs."

I find that disturbing. How do you know what God would have done for Michael? Maybe Michael's life turned out the way it did for a reason only God knows right now--as a believer, you surely believe in such things, don't you? Again, this is why I find what you write to be so presumptuous. It comes across to me as though you think you know better than anyone else (and maybe even better than God) how he should have lived his life. But you (and the rest of us) really don't know anything much about his faith or his personal relationship with God (beyond what Michael says) much less how his life might have been different had some element of his faith/faith practices been different. How could one possibly know that?

How do I know what God would have done for Michael? Because of what God has already done for me. When I began having a relationship with God according to His terms and His commandments, He removed a whole bunch of negative influences from life, which included people and things. He then surrounded with good, loving people. He has healed every area of my life, which was more than a mess. I've been healed physically, emotionally, spiritually and financially. This would not have happened had I not decided submit to God completely and be accountable to both Him and a community of fellow believers. You can find out more about God's promises to those who seek Him on His terms by reading the Bible with an open mind. One's relationship with God also affects one's relationship with others, and the decisions one makes. It actually works. Having a relationship with God doesn't mean that you won't have problems, but it means that you have access to the One who can solve ALL problems.

I'm not doubting Michael's salvation. He believed in God, acknowledged and had a relationship with God. He's at peace now. But he did not yield himself totally where God could heal every area of his life. Having an ideal/firm relationship with God means being accountable to both God and others. That's what keeps you grounded and out of trouble. We all have different opinions and could go on talking about this for days on end. I can only with share you what I know to be true. It worked for me.

IMO......The rabbi sounds like a woman that got married, couldn't change her husband into what she wanted, got divorced, blamed him for everything and turned into an nagging bitty.

The IRONY of the Rabbi saying MJ would've been protected from charlatans by the religious community is...he is a Jewish Rabbi who stole money from Michael's Heal The Kids charity as well as the L'Chaim society in order to fund a rich lifestyle and other homes.

Credible? I think not.

The IRONY of the Rabbi saying MJ would've been protected from charlatans by the religious community is...he is a Jewish Rabbi who stole money from Michael's Heal The Kids charity as well as the L'Chaim society in order to fund a rich lifestyle and other homes.

Credible? I think not.


Well said...:rock:

"There is also mental, emotional and spiritual health. In all these departments Michael was suffering severely." Um, who the f is this guy to judge? Suffering in spiritual and emotional health, what does that even mean? How does he know michael's inner thoughts? it is ridiculous that he would claim he knows all that goes on in his mind. So what if Michael's goal in life wasn't simply to be married, so what if he liked his alone time? that doesn't make him "suffering emotionally", that just means he is a more private person. Obviously. People DO have different personalities. It is sad how some people such as Rabbi Shmuley can not understand anyone but themselves. I think people should stop analyzing people's character traits and start loving, that's what Michael would have wanted.

Guess his book isn't selling as well as he had originally planned. I wish this guy would stop appearing in the media every other day. 5 days after michael's passing this guy shows up on CNN and says "oh, he was such a tortured soul." and "he brought out the worst qualities in all of us"??? and then he appears on larry king live AGAIN in september he says, "my first reaction upon hearing about his death was, anger. I was mad at him for doing this". The only pictures I can find of him WITH michael look photoshopped, like this one. He doesn't look like he belongs there. This guy is so obnoxious.

http://www.axisofjustice.org/wp-content/uploads/rabbi-shmuley-michael-jackson.jpg

Whoa, that picture is FUNNY! It makes Michael look like a giant, look how much bigger he is than Smelly!

IMO......The rabbi sounds like a woman that got married, couldn't change her husband into what she wanted, got divorced, blamed him for everything and turned into an nagging bitty.
On point... with that description of him. Atleast in my opinion. LOL

The IRONY of the Rabbi saying MJ would've been protected from charlatans by the religious community is...he is a Jewish Rabbi who stole money from Michael's Heal The Kids charity as well as the L'Chaim society in order to fund a rich lifestyle and other homes.

Credible? I think not.
Oh yes, that is the rub isn't it. I agree! NOT credible.


"There is also mental, emotional and spiritual health. In all these departments Michael was suffering severely." Um, who the f is this guy to judge? Suffering in spiritual and emotional health, what does that even mean? How does he know michael's inner thoughts? it is ridiculous that he would claim he knows all that goes on in his mind. So what if Michael's goal in life wasn't simply to be married, so what if he liked his alone time? that doesn't make him "suffering emotionally", that just means he is a more private person. Obviously. People DO have different personalities. It is sad how some people such as Rabbi Shmuley can not understand anyone but themselves. I think people should stop analyzing people's character traits and start loving, that's what Michael would have wanted.

Guess his book isn't selling as well as he had originally planned. I wish this guy would stop appearing in the media every other day. 5 days after michael's passing this guy shows up on CNN and says "oh, he was such a tortured soul." and "he brought out the worst qualities in all of us"??? and then he appears on larry king live AGAIN in september he says, "my first reaction upon hearing about his death was, anger. I was mad at him for doing this". The only pictures I can find of him WITH michael look photoshopped, like this one. He doesn't look like he belongs there. This guy is so obnoxious.

http://www.axisofjustice.org/wp-content/uploads/rabbi-shmuley-michael-jackson.jpg



Well said, I agree. and OH NO HE DID NOT!?!!!!!!! say he brought out the worst qualities in all of us?
Damn this man -not only trying to speak for MJ but now trying to speak for everyone else on the planet (or at the very least atleast trying to speak for everyone who knew MJ and was a part of his life)

This man makes me so mad. I can't even call him a rabbi... he's not. I don't care what he or anyone else says. ugh

That photo does look odd- makes MJ look really tall. LOL
I have seen other photos though-like with MJ at the Schmuley's family/etc.
He was really a part of MJ's life and atleast semi-close to him... but for a short period of time! I mean MJ was almost 51yrs old and Schmuley was around him a VERY short time in comparison to 50yrs yet he thinks he knows everything about MJ- even the things in MJ's mind that maybe NO ONE but MJ knew... even speaking about things in recent years and up to his death when he hadn't even SPOKE to him in many years. There is no way Schmuley could know that stuff. He's just talking out his a__... FOR THE MONEY!

I mean MJ was almost 51yrs old and Schmuley was around him a VERY short time in comparison to 50yrs yet he thinks he knows everything about MJ- even the things in MJ's mind that maybe NO ONE but MJ knew...

It's irritating beyond words that this guy acts like he knows Michael's every last thought, and what would've "saved" him. He needs to go focus on himself and why he's capitalizing on someone's death. That's not very rabbi-like, Schmuley.

i guess his book didnt do very well then. funny how someone knows so much yet hasnt been around mj since 2001. amazing

It's irritating beyond words that this guy acts like he knows Michael's every last thought, and what would've "saved" him. He needs to go focus on himself and why he's capitalizing on someone's death. That's not very rabbi-like, Schmuley.
I couldn't possibly agree with you more.

He's pretty strange as rabbis go, actually.

this Rabbi loves reading tabloids, and i can tell by the way he judges Michael without knowing him. i believe the Rabbi was the same one who told Michael, "i'm going to find you a wife". one time, he tried to set Michael up with Katie Couric, even after Michael told him that he was not interested in a journalist!

he keeps saying that people worshiped Michael like a deity, and that he was once a Jehovah's Witness, then invited Michael to come over to his home! wouldn't that be like "idol worship" ? hhmmmm, RABBBI?

now everyone will try to "earn" his best from MJ's death......... ff

this Rabbi loves reading tabloids, and i can tell by the way he judges Michael without knowing him. i believe the Rabbi was the same one who told Michael, "i'm going to find you a wife". one time, he tried to set Michael up with Katie Couric, even after Michael told him that he was not interested in a journalist!

he keeps saying that people worshiped Michael like a deity, and that he was once a Jehovah's Witness, then invited Michael to come over to his home! wouldn't that be like "idol worship" ? hhmmmm, RABBBI?
Well, supposedly Michael was the one who asked to have a date with her.

But this guy is a douhce, too. Along with the rest of them. Hmph.

okay then.... Michael was look at the footage

okay then.... Michael was look at the footage
I know.
That looked like a pretty healthy MJ to me.

this Rabbi loves reading tabloids, and i can tell by the way he judges Michael without knowing him. i believe the Rabbi was the same one who told Michael, "i'm going to find you a wife". one time, he tried to set Michael up with Katie Couric, even after Michael told him that he was not interested in a journalist!

he keeps saying that people worshiped Michael like a deity, and that he was once a Jehovah's Witness, then invited Michael to come over to his home! wouldn't that be like "idol worship" ? hhmmmm, RABBBI?

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but are you saying that the Rabbi was once a JW, or that Michael was? We know Mike was, of course, but if Shmuley Boteach was ever a JW, I'll eat my yarmulke...

How do I know what God would have done for Michael? Because of what God has already done for me. When I began having a relationship with God according to His terms and His commandments, He removed a whole bunch of negative influences from life, which included people and things. He then surrounded with good, loving people. He has healed every area of my life, which was more than a mess. I've been healed physically, emotionally, spiritually and financially. This would not have happened had I not decided submit to God completely and be accountable to both Him and a community of fellow believers. You can find out more about God's promises to those who seek Him on His terms by reading the Bible with an open mind. One's relationship with God also affects one's relationship with others, and the decisions one makes. It actually works. Having a relationship with God doesn't mean that you won't have problems, but it means that you have access to the One who can solve ALL problems.

I'm not doubting Michael's salvation. He believed in God, acknowledged and had a relationship with God. He's at peace now. But he did not yield himself totally where God could heal every area of his life. Having an ideal/firm relationship with God means being accountable to both God and others. That's what keeps you grounded and out of trouble. We all have different opinions and could go on talking about this for days on end. I can only with share you what I know to be true. It worked for me.
That was so nicely stated kinerethchai about what a relationship with God will truly do for a person.

How do I know what God would have done for Michael? Because of what God has already done for me. When I began having a relationship with God according to His terms and His commandments, He removed a whole bunch of negative influences from life, which included people and things. He then surrounded with good, loving people. He has healed every area of my life, which was more than a mess. I've been healed physically, emotionally, spiritually and financially. This would not have happened had I not decided submit to God completely and be accountable to both Him and a community of fellow believers. You can find out more about God's promises to those who seek Him on His terms by reading the Bible with an open mind. One's relationship with God also affects one's relationship with others, and the decisions one makes. It actually works. Having a relationship with God doesn't mean that you won't have problems, but it means that you have access to the One who can solve ALL problems.

I'm not doubting Michael's salvation. He believed in God, acknowledged and had a relationship with God. He's at peace now. But he did not yield himself totally where God could heal every area of his life. Having an ideal/firm relationship with God means being accountable to both God and others. That's what keeps you grounded and out of trouble. We all have different opinions and could go on talking about this for days on end. I can only with share you what I know to be true. It worked for me.

What you see as God doing for you, I see as YOU doing for you. You are using your own belief in something as a tool to achieve what you desire. From my perspective, there is no outside force "fixing" things for you - YOU are the one making changes in your life. You are accountable to yourself above all else, and you choose to make yourself accountable to others as well. If you need to believe in a God to make those changes in your life, that's fine - billions of people around the world feel the same way. But you're the one making changes, you're the one treating yourself right, and you're the one creating your own happiness. There's nobody "out there" doing everything for you magically.

What you see as God doing for you, I see as YOU doing for you. You are using your own belief in something as a tool to achieve what you desire. From my perspective, there is no outside force "fixing" things for you - YOU are the one making changes in your life. You are accountable to yourself above all else, and you choose to make yourself accountable to others as well. If you need to believe in a God to make those changes in your life, that's fine - billions of people around the world feel the same way. But you're the one making changes, you're the one treating yourself right, and you're the one creating your own happiness. There's nobody "out there" doing everything for you magically.
Thank you, Etoile. This is also what I believe.

The belief in God may be the motivation but the changes that have been made in your life were done solely by you -- in the thought process of "is this what God would approve of?"

That is why you don't live a trouble-free life even with the acceptance of God; it's YOU who made those changes. Any problems that you have to deal with are solved & worked out by you, using the motivation of God. But there is noone giving you the answers or solving them for you.

If I may...Michael had set up his life in such a way that he didn't have to be accountable to anybody. When there is nobody to be accountable to, it is easy for a person to go off the rails. When someone would require accountabilty from Michael, it seems to me that he would dismiss them, detatch from them.
When a person is addicted, they don't want accountabilty. Accountability would mean that they have to look at themselves, and perhaps change thier behavior. It seems Micheal did not have the strength/will/desire to change. Anyone who asked for him to change would find that they couldn't reach him anymore...that is what I have been led to believe.

Schmuley means well....I really believe that. I do not think he means any harm to Michael's memory. He said that if we don't look at what drove Michael to his death, then he will have died in vain.

I intend to agree.

I think Schmuley is rightly concerned that if the public sees him as fit, healthy, happy and peaceful in TII, then they will be missing the boat. The public shrugs and says "Wow...he was doing so great...that damn doctor killed him...what a shame."

And THAT would be a tragic way to think. IMO. Given with love, of course.
I agree with what you are saying. Michael did not look well to me, even though he's dancing, singing and smiling. I think the Rabbi should keep quiet now. He has made his point and his money off of Michael.

Let's remember, though, that Smelly wasn't talking about Michael's physical health, which is all we can see onscreen.

If I may...Michael had set up his life in such a way that he didn't have to be accountable to anybody. When there is nobody to be accountable to, it is easy for a person to go off the rails. When someone would require accountabilty from Michael, it seems to me that he would dismiss them, detatch from them.
When a person is addicted, they don't want accountabilty. Accountability would mean that they have to look at themselves, and perhaps change thier behavior. It seems Micheal did not have the strength/will/desire to change. Anyone who asked for him to change would find that they couldn't reach him anymore...that is what I have been led to believe.

Schmuley means well....I really believe that. I do not think he means any harm to Michael's memory. He said that if we don't look at what drove Michael to his death, then he will have died in vain.

I intend to agree.

I think Schmuley is rightly concerned that if the public sees him as fit, healthy, happy and peaceful in TII, then they will be missing the boat. The public shrugs and says "Wow...he was doing so great...that damn doctor killed him...what a shame."

And THAT would be a tragic way to think. IMO. Given with love, of course.

My only problem is that the stuff Schmuley is saying (about the drug problem) is OUTDATED.. and if you don't believe that, then how does that "jive" (for lack of a better word I can think of right now) with the supposed autopsy reports of no pain medicine in his system? Schmuley wasn't saying a thing about addiction to anesthesia... he's presuming because during the time HE knew him, years and years ago, that because MJ was overmedicated then (which I tend to agree during Invincible era but that's just my speculation, I don't know for sure...) - that he still was many years later when he died. But he didn't die with those drugs in his system so.... I fail to see the logic in trying to spread THAT message because it really has nothing to do with his death.... atleast that we know.

Point is- Schmuley knows no more about the last 6+yrs about Michael than we do- period. So no one should take his word for anything about Michael in his later years!
And he's also a liar...and in my book if you lie once, you'll lie again. And he IS a liar- make no mistake about that. (specifically he's lied about the reason he broke ties with Michael... his story on that is a total fabrication- not to mention he misappropriated funds meant for a charity - TO HIMSELF- so that alone puts him on my lowlife list)

My only problem is that the stuff Schmuley is saying (about the drug problem) is OUTDATED.. and if you don't believe that, then how does that "jive" (for lack of a better word I can think of right now) with the supposed autopsy reports of no pain medicine in his system? Schmuley wasn't saying a thing about addiction to anesthesia... he's presuming because during the time HE knew him, years and years ago, that because MJ was overmedicated then (which I tend to agree during Invincible era but that's just my speculation, I don't know for sure...) - that he still was many years later when he died. But he didn't die with those drugs in his system so.... I fail to see the logic in trying to spread THAT message because it really has nothing to do with his death.... atleast that we know.

Point is- Schmuley knows no more about the last 6+yrs about Michael than we do- period. So no one should take his word for anything about Michael in his later years!
And he's also a liar...and in my book if you lie once, you'll lie again. And he IS a liar- make no mistake about that. (specifically he's lied about the reason he broke ties with Michael... his story on that is a total fabrication- not to mention he misappropriated funds meant for a charity - TO HIMSELF- so that alone puts him on my lowlife list)
I see both you & MilliesMom's points -- Michael did have a problem.

But overall, I'm with you, Zippy. Shmuley speculated -- for he stated he never actually SAW Michael taking any kind of medication -- that Michael was medicated. Yes, there was something going on with him during his Invincible run & there were times where he acted very medicated. But in the recent years? He looked very upbeat, very happy, the way someone "recovering" would look. Yes, he had his personal demons & probably some kind of mental issues, but I do not believe he looked unhealthy in the TII film we've been presented or that he was "over-medicated" at any time recently.

What you see as God doing for you, I see as YOU doing for you. You are using your own belief in something as a tool to achieve what you desire. From my perspective, there is no outside force "fixing" things for you - YOU are the one making changes in your life. You are accountable to yourself above all else, and you choose to make yourself accountable to others as well. If you need to believe in a God to make those changes in your life, that's fine - billions of people around the world feel the same way. But you're the one making changes, you're the one treating yourself right, and you're the one creating your own happiness. There's nobody "out there" doing everything for you magically.

Exactly. Thank you.

anything new?
I must say I read Boteach's book and I didnt like it because I got the impression for Boteach nothing is ever ever good enough..
Come on MJ was human, humans get ill, humans sometimes are not healthy and yes we humans sometimes have cronic illneses...does it make anyone less of a person or less capable ? Come on...I wonder if Boteach had ever had a cold, ever broken a bone or ever had a headache...No offense but Boteach makes everything sound imperfect, bad and not worthy...
So Boteach saying MJ wasnt healthy..well his heart and soul was healthy and his body was in better condition than mine right now...
so Boteach should really tell me something new and I am eager to hear it..

anything new?
I must say I read Boteach's book and I didnt like it because I got the impression for Boteach nothing is ever ever good enough..
Come on MJ was human, humans get ill, humans sometimes are not healthy and yes we humans sometimes have cronic illneses...does it make anyone less of a person or less capable ? Come on...I wonder if Boteach had ever had a cold, ever broken a bone or ever had a headache...No offense but Boteach makes everything sound imperfect, bad and not worthy...
So Boteach saying MJ wasnt healthy..well his heart and soul was healthy and his body was in better condition than mine right now...
so Boteach should really tell me something new and I am eager to hear it..
Boteach is all about God.
It's like you suck at life if you don't follow some God. WTHHHH.

Blarg, I'm getting 'preaching vibes' off this thread. I thought conjecture on Michael's religion was off limits? Michael's relationship to God was between him and God, and I'm seriously uncomfortable with people discussing it --or their own religous beliefs. I was looking for info on Smelly, not on how God can help me pr anyone else improve my life. If I wanted that I'd have gone elsewhere on the web.

Well, supposedly Michael was the one who asked to have a date with her.

But this guy is a douhce, too. Along with the rest of them. Hmph.

i believe Katie Couric told the Rabbi that she was seeing someone at the time. she was too uncertain what to think about this whole situation, because of the middle man (the Rabbi) relaying messages from Michael. Katie had no idea that Michael was receiving spiritual advice from this Rabbi, until the Rabbi mentioned that he knew Michael!

i'm just confused as to why Michael would be interested in Katie, knowing that she is a journalist/news reporter.

i believe Katie Couric told the Rabbi that she was seeing someone at the time. she was too uncertain what to think about this whole situation, because of the middle man (the Rabbi) relaying messages from Michael. Katie had no idea that Michael was receiving spiritual advice from this Rabbi, until the Rabbi mentioned that he knew Michael!

i'm just confused as to why Michael would be interested in Katie, knowing that she is a journalist/news reporter.
Exactly, that's my question.
And I'm sorry, but, a grown man who is a rabbi should not be "hooking" people up. That's the last thing he should be doing.

Exactly, that's my question.
And I'm sorry, but, a grown man who is a rabbi should not be "hooking" people up. That's the last thing he should be doing.

That's what the matchmakers are for! ;)

Gosh this man is being silly, excuse me. I didn't care for what he wrote. He thinks Michael didn't have God in his life now, oh please! Yes he did, read interviews with Michael where he's talking about God and everything.
Jeez I don't understand the rabbi.:mellow:

i think that michael was just so misunderstood, i know he made mistakes, he was a human being and that is what we do. but all in all i believe that michael was a product of his environment. he learned how to be distrusting at a very early age, he learned that people will lie and hurt you to benefit themselves. so much of what michael said was taken out of context, and this rabbi did the same thing all the others did. in the end of the book the "tapes" he interjected his own beliefs about michael and how he thought he should have lived and speculated on how michael felt, rather than to truly listen to michaels views on life and religion and family.

That's what the matchmakers are for! ;)
Exactly!

i think that michael was just so misunderstood, i know he made mistakes, he was a human being and that is what we do. but all in all i believe that michael was a product of his environment. he learned how to be distrusting at a very early age, he learned that people will lie and hurt you to benefit themselves. so much of what michael said was taken out of context, and this rabbi did the same thing all the others did. in the end of the book the "tapes" he interjected his own beliefs about michael and how he thought he should have lived and speculated on how michael felt, rather than to truly listen to michaels views on life and religion and family.
I know, talk about judging people!

judge not, lest ye be judged.

read it and weep, "rabbi" schmuley.
Your day will come soon enough.... repent now.

that's all I'm saying.

^ :toofunny: REPENT NOW!!

haha
Really, though!

Exactly, that's my question.
And I'm sorry, but, a grown man who is a rabbi should not be "hooking" people up. That's the last thing he should be doing.

haha, i agree. if this Rabbi would have stayed out of Michael's personal life, he would have appreciated the time he spent with Michael. but no, he wants to paint this picture of Michael being a lonely, misguided man.

haha, i agree. if this Rabbi would have stayed out of Michael's personal life, he would have appreciated the time he spent with Michael. but no, he wants to paint this picture of Michael being a lonely, misguided man.
Right while contrasting that he's this good guy, going in the right direction trying to help people & yada, yada, yada. He's such a hypocrite!

Did you guys read the part about him talking about his beard? Like wth, even though it's a religious thing, you're not conforming to society if you shave...

Where's the part about his beard, tyff?

I take it his book is not selling well?

On the contrary...it's #4 in Michael Jackson memoirs, #10 in African-American memoirs, and #13 in musician memoirs. #2237 out of all books. This is on the USA Amazon.com site.

Ugh
I didn't think he was doing that well.
ugh ugh ugh
*sigh*

Where's the part about his beard, tyff?
It's when he's talking about image & says how his wife didn't want him to shave because she didn't marry someone based on his looks but on his heart or something like that.

Yeah, this is the Rabbi who's now 'counseling' John Gosselin, sells bobbleheads on his website, and wrote a book called, "Kosher Sex"... he's REAL credible. *sarcasm*

I know!
Why is he getting involved with all these 'celebrities' -- more like people who just make headlines for ridiculous reasons. I'm sure there are plenty of men like Jon Gosselin who are NOT in the news. Why isn't he writing books about counseling those people?

And I laughed when I read that title, Kosher Sex. I thought religious people weren't even supposed to have sex unless they were procreating.

Yeah, this is the Rabbi who's now 'counseling' John Gosselin, sells bobbleheads on his website, and wrote a book called, "Kosher Sex"... he's REAL credible. *sarcasm*

Are you serious???? HAHA!!!!!! Oh wow, and were suppose to believe his "spiritual wisdom" or whatever? lol

Oh lawd.. John Gosselin and bobbleheads?
I knew about Kosher Sex but oh lawd.......

Oh lawd.. John Gosselin and bobbleheads?
I knew about Kosher Sex but oh lawd.......
I know, this guy is a joke!

My opinion is that a spiritual or religious leader should focus on the betterment of ALL. Kosher Sex is along those lines, with it he speaks to anyone who reads it. But attaching himself to celebrities (crap, Michael's gone, I need a new one...John Gosselin!) makes it look like the only person he's interested in bettering is himself.

My opinion is that a spiritual or religious leader should focus on the betterment of ALL. Kosher Sex is along those lines, with it he speaks to anyone who reads it. But attaching himself to celebrities (crap, Michael's gone, I need a new one...John Gosselin!) makes it look like the only person he's interested in bettering is himself.
He writes these books with seemingly good intentions, then he goes & shamelessly plugs them in a book -- even though he tries to justify it -- in which they aren't germane. He was lucky enough to be in the camp of MJ -- Michael Jackson!!! -- and after that, he didn't have enough. There is NO OTHER reason for someone to put out a book the way he did & speak about Michael the way he did other than to gain publicity & money -- get your face in the paper.

Look at Chris Tucker & Macaulay Culkin --- where have they been? They haven't been in the papers or on the big screen in a while, yet are they selling their stories to get noticed? Nope. 'Cause they were genuine & respected the time they had. Did they put a bunch of effort to be in the camera, talk about Michael after his death? Not at all.

In my eyes, if it was a relationship that went downhill for Schmuley, then he should have no reason to talk about it -- it's dead & gone. Didn't work out. Leave it at that.

And the fact that he's got ANOTHER celebrity protege or whatever, just proves this guy is out for image. You can help anyone in John Gosselin's place who isn't a celebrity & who IS Jewish, but he picked him. Hmmm....

^co-sign everything you said tyff!

Can the story get anymore farfetched? Apparently, yes. Sickening.

I don't know WHO Schmuley thinks he's fooling.
Honestly.